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Discussion of "dapma"

Comment #1: What to do...
Jonathan (Fri May 29 16:19:27 2015)

Alternatively we could just create a new gismu that means the opposite. I'm
not sure dapma can lose all its negative connotations now; the negative
connotations have already been translated into so many languages, it is
even in the Lojban definition "the noi mabla" bit.

For the English definition to the counterpart I would write:
"x1 blesses/well-wishes x2 with/into fate x3"

Comment #2: Re: What to do...
Curtis W Franks (Fri May 29 16:37:43 2015)

spheniscine wrote:
> Alternatively we could just create a new gismu that means the opposite.
I'm
> not sure dapma can lose all its negative connotations now; the negative

> connotations have already been translated into so many languages, it is
> even in the Lojban definition "the noi mabla" bit.
>
> For the English definition to the counterpart I would write:
> "x1 blesses/well-wishes x2 with/into fate x3"


I do think that a neutral definition is good to have too. Something along
the lines of "x1 wills/dictates x2 into fate/outcome/(life-)path x3".

For the positive definition, "well-wishes" seems somewhat weak. Maybe
"endows/gifts"? That way, it still sounds positive, but it is guaranteed
(which, for a curse, it presumably is expected to be). I would also add
"/destiny" right after "fate", in order to connote positively.

But I agree. This definition is inherently negative in the English
interpretation and we need more words while specifying this usage more
clearly.

Comment #3: neutral sense needed
Vincent Broman nohu la bremenli (Mon Apr 25 23:45:13 2016)

Even if we could create a gismu for bless, to replace the clumsy to'edapma
(ugh), it still would not help express cases where the fate imposed is
mixed instead of all good or all bad. I think xagdapma or zandapma versus
xladapma or maldapma are good for bless and curse. The general case could
be like:
x1 imposes or calls on a greater power to impose on x2 fate/destiny x3.
Note: since cursing is much common than blessing, that is the default when
unspecified by x3 or a compound.

Comment #4: Re: neutral sense needed
gleki (Tue Apr 26 08:44:08 2016)

vpbroman wrote:
> Even if we could create a gismu for bless, to replace the clumsy
to'edapma
> (ugh), it still would not help express cases where the fate imposed is
> mixed instead of all good or all bad. I think xagdapma or zandapma versus

> xladapma or maldapma are good for bless and curse. The general case could

> be like:
> x1 imposes or calls on a greater power to impose on x2 fate/destiny x3.

Definition #66163 is something like that.

> Note: since cursing is much common than blessing, that is the default
when
> unspecified by x3 or a compound.

Comment #5: Re: neutral sense needed
Jonathan (Tue Apr 26 17:32:17 2016)

I have made an ismu for that: apma

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